I can imagine the sound of champagne bottles popping from Martha's Vineyard to Washington D.C., as President Donald Trump's haters celebrate this third, historic federal indictment.
Alan, your article is 100% correct! In addition, this is what we are looking at: "Lavrentiy Beria, the most ruthless and longest-serving secret police chief in Joseph Stalin’s reign of terror in Russia and Eastern Europe, bragged that he could prove criminal conduct on anyone, even the innocent. “Show me the man and I’ll show you the crime” was Beria’s infamous boast." Michael Henry, Oxford Eagle. Published 2:49 pm Wednesday, May 9, 2018.
Trump was President at the time and has total immunity. If it was not for our fake MSM I would not even be writing this. Russia is winning this horrendous war in the Ukraine and this is not even being reported by our fake MS
If you read news from other parts of the world, not controlled by Western media, you are 100% correct, Russia is clearly winning the war. All this is ignored.
Mr Dershowitz......Trump was not and is not wrong in calling the election fraudulent over and over....he is making a point....if you have not learned by now that every word out of his mouth has a purpose then you need to do a bit more thinking....he reminds us so that we will always be looking at how our elections ARE FRAUD.....there was so much fraud that we the people never had a vote at all......maybe you should write on that......the BorgDems stole the election.....we have proof.....there is nothing wrong much less criminal with Trump always reminding the people that we need to clean up the election......and that is all he is doing......and really?.....there were more votes than people voting......check that out......and Biden got more votes than Obama another communist evil hateful man......Trump very well knows as he is a Godly person that things go in a way for certain reasons only known to God.....but you being a Trump hater are totally wrong.....you try to be objective but your premise is wrong......and i myself would like for Obama who is behind Biden to stop this communism.....actually i do hope all these BorgDems go to prison for the injustices they have created to half our population........this double standard......this proven wrong global warming agenda including blocking the sun....of stopping farmers from farming.....of putting toxic wastes like in Ohio in our water and food....and you need to see the series Remedy on Vaccines and how toxic they are to us.....you are not very educated Sir except in the law perhaps.......you once thought that FGM was ok because of religious freedom....so you would brutalize women for the sake of religious freedom???...give me a break.......Dr. Jasser corrected you on that.....you think it is ok for a government to invade our bodies with let’s say vaccines....it is never allowed to take away our personal freedoms.....you know the law better than I do but you do not know the depth of heart that I have and love of our rights that I have along with many others.....you are still a BorgDem which is a slavery party and if you don’t even know that then you are way more ignorant than i have even said.... Even RFK has to learn that.....he romanticizes the Dem party.....you are very much in ignorance and it is the Dem Party that is destroying our country in all ways along with Rhinos......
I still don't understand why you find that the evidence is strong in the documents indictment. There is zero precedent for insisting that former presidents don't have rights to their records. The PRA insists that they have unrestricted access to their documents and that any copies are exempt from having to be turned over to NARA. Even with obstruction they were slowly cooperating. Why didn't DOJ simply go to court and ask the court to compel compliance with the subpoena? Especially in Ft. Pierce, FL they have an uphill battle to convince a mostly red jury pool that Trump should be prosecuted when Hillary and Biden were not.
It’s weird that you left out Trump moving the classified documents, showing them off to journalists, and trying to erase tapes… it kind of delegitimizes all your arguments as biased.
There is no proof as yet that documents were shown to journalists. ( Actually it was an author with his publisher.) We heard papers being shuffled, and the former President basically refusing to share them, without ruining the friendship. “Too bad I can’t declassify these for you.” A witness may come forward who saw that the papers in his Bridgewater office were in fact classified documents, but until then, they were simply papers kept in New Jersey on his desk. .
As soon as you start talking about polling you have lost the thread of the argument. I think Jack Smith did not overreach and will be able to prove these alternate electors were created to subvert the election. I respect your opinion about his supporters but again it’s about evidence of wrongdoing in a court of law. They have a very strong case. It comes down can they prove that Trump knew he lost because the electoral vote was exactly the same as 2016 except in reverse
I am not a Trump fan, I do not support his run in this GOP primary and it would take an extraordinary turn of events for me to vote for him in the 2024 general election.
Signature significance posits that a single act (or multiple similar acts) can be so remarkable that it has predictive and analytical value, and should not be dismissed as statistically insignificant.
To me this looks like the Democrats are actively weaponizing the Department of Justice and appearances in this regard are signature significant. This is pure and simple an abuse of power.
Steve, I hope you understand I feel the same way about Biden. This is from a 45+ year D. Biden is the worst D I have seen in my lifetime. I call him the great pretender.
I haven't voted for Joe Biden, Donald Trump, or Hillary Clinton in the past, I think they're all pieces of s*** propagandists! In my opinion, Camila Harris is a bald-faced liar that will say anything to advance her agenda and any ticket that includes her will never, ever, get my vote, period. I also wouldn't vote for Mike Pence for president, he has the personality of a type B slug that's just barely capable of going through the motions, he also reminds me of the hypocritical southern Baptist preachers I grew up with. At this point in time the only candidate I actually "like" is Chris Christie, he's a straight forward politician and an experienced political leader that lacks a false facade, he appears to be a man of integrity, what you see and hear is exactly what you get, but unfortunately he doesn't seem to have the wide-spread support that's needed to win.
It's time for Republicans to move on from Donald Trump. Voting for Trump now is revenge against what the Democrats have done since 2016 and is no way to move forward, it's pure divisiveness and we need to do better. Don't get me wrong, the Democrats really need to be figuratively taken behind the woodshed and taught a good lesson about ethics, morality, respect and the Constitution but Donald Trump is NOT the person to do that.
I want a ethical, moral, respectful and experienced third party candidate, someone that can stand up to the ridiculous extremes of both the Democrat's and Republican's without jumping in the propaganda political gutter.
I'm sick and tired of being sick and tired of the two dominate political parties. Something needs to change.
Steve, I would say the best persons to take Merrick andJB + company behind the woodshed are the voters who are watching their franchise be stolen from them. Whether it seems wrong to you is irrelevant; the fact is ugly conduct by the party in power against his probable opponent, will move people back to that candidate even if they were drawing toward others. It is the behavior of the party (D) you have to blame if Trump becomes President once again.
The time for blatant misconduct has passed. It’s election season, and the antics are much too transparent.
Well Steve, you are a beta, so instead of looking at what is happening in this country, you watch the MSM and form your opinion. Ever break bread with Trump? Might change your thinking to reality.
I don't agree with you politically, but I respect you as one of the last reasonable liberal minds, along with RFK Jr. And thank you for always explaining things so everyone can understand.
The analogy is fairly obvious. If one cannot prove to a judge a crime has been committed, they have no legal right to break the law to seek redress. (State of Nevada v. Orenthal James Simpson, et al, Case Number: 07C237890-4)
N.B. Please, do not ever again assume gender in your comments. I am not nor have I ever been the owner of male genitalia. It’s insulting and frankly sexiest to make that presumption. Do better!
Your omission of the small mountain of authoritative evidence of widespread and systematic electoral fraud in the 2020 US elections - video testimonies from many senior Republican observers, and security footage of boxes of ballot papers pulled from under counting room tables and fed into tally machines while counting had supposedly been suspended, to name but two - perpetuates the myth that the elections were free and fair.
All false. See Disproven: My Unbiased Search for Voter Fraud for the Trump Campaign, the Data that Shows Why He Lost, and How We Can Improve Our Elections by Ken Block
Block was the data scientist hired by the Trump campaign to investigate every fraud claim.
There are two ways to look at the actions of President Trump after the 2020 before certification. You could conclude that he was acting as a candidate to be able to overthrow the “results” of the state counts announced on TV. The second way is to consider his actions those of fulfilling the Take Care Clause, secondary to his oath of office, to “take care that the laws are faithfully executed.” (Specifically his responsibility), regardless of the results of his actions. Because there were significant irregularities in the election, the matter needed to be attended to in a timely fashion. This goes directly to motive. It is the burden of the State to prove a men rea, a criminal intent.
For such a senior jurist, your omission of the small mountain of video evidence, including many detailed testimonies from experienced Republican electoral volunteers and security footage of boxes of ballot papers being pulled from under counting room tables and entered into counting machines overnight while counting had supposedly been halted overnight, is beyond belief.
By failing to mention that evidence, your statement "Trump's behavior following his 2020 loss was wrong." helps to perpetuate the myth that the 2020 elections were 'free and fair' when clearly they were anything but.
It gets a little confusing as to whether we are commenting on what someone has written or to Professor Dershowitz’s article. The Professor’s article was excellent and insightful.
The analogy by S Water does not relate to the indictment. Maybe S Water can explain his analogy. I don’t see how it relates.
Hypothetically, let’s say a man’s one year old son has been stolen from his crib. The father is distraught. One year later, he sees a child with a woman who looks remarkably like his son. He informs the authorities, but the police inform the father he is mistaken; it’s not his son. The father doesn’t accept the explanation and uses the court to prove his paternity. A DNA test reveals the boy isn’t his and the case is thrown out. But the father doesn’t believe the test is accurate. He decides, with the help of his friends, to enter the home of this child in the dead of night and take him from his bed. He believes the child is his and it is the only way he knows to get his son back. The plan fails when the families security system detects the father’s friends trying to enter the house. Should the father and his friends be be charged for conspiracy to attempt a kidnapping? Or, as you say, the father was simply wrong and being wrong is not a crime. He believes the boy to be his and as long as he believed - no problem. He doesn’t have to face charges for attempted kidnapping. Happy days! I think we all know this result is preposterous.
In this case there is absolute proof, scientific proof the boy is not his own. The court held the child was not his. He might have appealed, but he committed a two crimes by B+ E, and attempting to kidnap. He needs a good attorney and sympathetic jury.
The facts of the case are not analogous to the subject at hand.
Like the amplify I presented, there is absolute proof that the specific accusations of fraud are false. Ken Block, a data scientist specialising in elections, was hired by the Trump Campaign to investigate every claim of fraud. He determined that all of them were false and explains why in his book,
Disproven: My Unbiased Search for Voter Fraud for the Trump Campaign, the Data that Shows Why He Lost, and How We Can Improve Our Elections
Have you read it? Will you read it? Of course not, because critical thinking demands review of information that doesn’t necessarily align with ideology and has nothing to do with confirming a bias.
I don’t see how this relates to the indictment or to what happened and what is currently happening. It is very clear that the democratic party is doing whatever they can to get rid of their strongest opponent in the upcoming election. If this indictment is so legitimate, why are they just now pulling it out of the bag ? It’s so obvious ! Grasping at straws!
The hypothetical scenario relates to counts 2-4 of the indictment. Regardless of whether DJT believed he won the election on account of fraud, his campaign was unable to prove it in court. It filed over 60 lawsuits and lost every one. No one had the legal right to obstruct the certification of the election, nor to arrange for a slate of fake electors, nor to pressure the vice president to refuse certification in contravention of the 22nd amendment of the constitution as has been alleged. His ‘belief’ is not a defence.
The indictment is legitimate because it was the opinion of 16-23 citizens (not the Democratic Party, the President, nor Attorney General) of a grand jury, after reviewing the evidence, that there is a probable cause the crimes were committed. As with all indictments, President Trump is presumed innocent.
You likely see the indictment as illegitimate and grasping at straws because, as a supporter of Donald Trump, all of your news information is derived from sources friendly to the former president. They tell viewers and readers this is a witch-hunt , that the charges are meritless. You are living in a bubble of information shared by people with the same ideology - your tribe.
The law functions outside of the tribes. Lady justice prevails even in the most disturbing of times. If President Trump
Is innocent of the charges, I believe he will be acquitted.
If you believe the analogy to be erroneous,, challenge it. Explain what elements in the hypothetical case are dissimilar to the former President’s case. Make a cohesive argument and have fun with it. What you’ve written is of no meaning without anything to substantiate your point.
Alan, your article is 100% correct! In addition, this is what we are looking at: "Lavrentiy Beria, the most ruthless and longest-serving secret police chief in Joseph Stalin’s reign of terror in Russia and Eastern Europe, bragged that he could prove criminal conduct on anyone, even the innocent. “Show me the man and I’ll show you the crime” was Beria’s infamous boast." Michael Henry, Oxford Eagle. Published 2:49 pm Wednesday, May 9, 2018.
Trump was President at the time and has total immunity. If it was not for our fake MSM I would not even be writing this. Russia is winning this horrendous war in the Ukraine and this is not even being reported by our fake MS
SM.
.
If you read news from other parts of the world, not controlled by Western media, you are 100% correct, Russia is clearly winning the war. All this is ignored.
The President has immunity from prosecution whilst in office. He does not enjoy immunity from potential crimes committed in office once he has left.
Mr Dershowitz......Trump was not and is not wrong in calling the election fraudulent over and over....he is making a point....if you have not learned by now that every word out of his mouth has a purpose then you need to do a bit more thinking....he reminds us so that we will always be looking at how our elections ARE FRAUD.....there was so much fraud that we the people never had a vote at all......maybe you should write on that......the BorgDems stole the election.....we have proof.....there is nothing wrong much less criminal with Trump always reminding the people that we need to clean up the election......and that is all he is doing......and really?.....there were more votes than people voting......check that out......and Biden got more votes than Obama another communist evil hateful man......Trump very well knows as he is a Godly person that things go in a way for certain reasons only known to God.....but you being a Trump hater are totally wrong.....you try to be objective but your premise is wrong......and i myself would like for Obama who is behind Biden to stop this communism.....actually i do hope all these BorgDems go to prison for the injustices they have created to half our population........this double standard......this proven wrong global warming agenda including blocking the sun....of stopping farmers from farming.....of putting toxic wastes like in Ohio in our water and food....and you need to see the series Remedy on Vaccines and how toxic they are to us.....you are not very educated Sir except in the law perhaps.......you once thought that FGM was ok because of religious freedom....so you would brutalize women for the sake of religious freedom???...give me a break.......Dr. Jasser corrected you on that.....you think it is ok for a government to invade our bodies with let’s say vaccines....it is never allowed to take away our personal freedoms.....you know the law better than I do but you do not know the depth of heart that I have and love of our rights that I have along with many others.....you are still a BorgDem which is a slavery party and if you don’t even know that then you are way more ignorant than i have even said.... Even RFK has to learn that.....he romanticizes the Dem party.....you are very much in ignorance and it is the Dem Party that is destroying our country in all ways along with Rhinos......
I still don't understand why you find that the evidence is strong in the documents indictment. There is zero precedent for insisting that former presidents don't have rights to their records. The PRA insists that they have unrestricted access to their documents and that any copies are exempt from having to be turned over to NARA. Even with obstruction they were slowly cooperating. Why didn't DOJ simply go to court and ask the court to compel compliance with the subpoena? Especially in Ft. Pierce, FL they have an uphill battle to convince a mostly red jury pool that Trump should be prosecuted when Hillary and Biden were not.
Democrats contested 2004 election results in Ohio. Why did they not go to jail? Please cite the source of your claim.
It’s weird that you left out Trump moving the classified documents, showing them off to journalists, and trying to erase tapes… it kind of delegitimizes all your arguments as biased.
There is no proof as yet that documents were shown to journalists. ( Actually it was an author with his publisher.) We heard papers being shuffled, and the former President basically refusing to share them, without ruining the friendship. “Too bad I can’t declassify these for you.” A witness may come forward who saw that the papers in his Bridgewater office were in fact classified documents, but until then, they were simply papers kept in New Jersey on his desk. .
I see this was August. The “classifed” document in the Bridgewater office turned out to be a map. It will not be prosecuted.
Agreed! But even if that part is left out… moving the boxes, wanting to erase tapes. The coverup can still get you!
As soon as you start talking about polling you have lost the thread of the argument. I think Jack Smith did not overreach and will be able to prove these alternate electors were created to subvert the election. I respect your opinion about his supporters but again it’s about evidence of wrongdoing in a court of law. They have a very strong case. It comes down can they prove that Trump knew he lost because the electoral vote was exactly the same as 2016 except in reverse
Outstanding opinion.
I am not a Trump fan, I do not support his run in this GOP primary and it would take an extraordinary turn of events for me to vote for him in the 2024 general election.
Signature significance posits that a single act (or multiple similar acts) can be so remarkable that it has predictive and analytical value, and should not be dismissed as statistically insignificant.
To me this looks like the Democrats are actively weaponizing the Department of Justice and appearances in this regard are signature significant. This is pure and simple an abuse of power.
Steve, I hope you understand I feel the same way about Biden. This is from a 45+ year D. Biden is the worst D I have seen in my lifetime. I call him the great pretender.
I don't like Biden one bit either.
I haven't voted for Joe Biden, Donald Trump, or Hillary Clinton in the past, I think they're all pieces of s*** propagandists! In my opinion, Camila Harris is a bald-faced liar that will say anything to advance her agenda and any ticket that includes her will never, ever, get my vote, period. I also wouldn't vote for Mike Pence for president, he has the personality of a type B slug that's just barely capable of going through the motions, he also reminds me of the hypocritical southern Baptist preachers I grew up with. At this point in time the only candidate I actually "like" is Chris Christie, he's a straight forward politician and an experienced political leader that lacks a false facade, he appears to be a man of integrity, what you see and hear is exactly what you get, but unfortunately he doesn't seem to have the wide-spread support that's needed to win.
It's time for Republicans to move on from Donald Trump. Voting for Trump now is revenge against what the Democrats have done since 2016 and is no way to move forward, it's pure divisiveness and we need to do better. Don't get me wrong, the Democrats really need to be figuratively taken behind the woodshed and taught a good lesson about ethics, morality, respect and the Constitution but Donald Trump is NOT the person to do that.
I want a ethical, moral, respectful and experienced third party candidate, someone that can stand up to the ridiculous extremes of both the Democrat's and Republican's without jumping in the propaganda political gutter.
I'm sick and tired of being sick and tired of the two dominate political parties. Something needs to change.
Steve, I would say the best persons to take Merrick andJB + company behind the woodshed are the voters who are watching their franchise be stolen from them. Whether it seems wrong to you is irrelevant; the fact is ugly conduct by the party in power against his probable opponent, will move people back to that candidate even if they were drawing toward others. It is the behavior of the party (D) you have to blame if Trump becomes President once again.
The time for blatant misconduct has passed. It’s election season, and the antics are much too transparent.
Well Steve, you are a beta, so instead of looking at what is happening in this country, you watch the MSM and form your opinion. Ever break bread with Trump? Might change your thinking to reality.
I never watch MSM, I mean never.
I'm an independent.
I'm intently observing what's happening in the USA in the 21st century.
How about you taking a little time to read my blog before you spout such ridiculous partisan nonsense.
https://stevewitherspoon.home.blog/
I don't agree with you politically, but I respect you as one of the last reasonable liberal minds, along with RFK Jr. And thank you for always explaining things so everyone can understand.
The analogy is fairly obvious. If one cannot prove to a judge a crime has been committed, they have no legal right to break the law to seek redress. (State of Nevada v. Orenthal James Simpson, et al, Case Number: 07C237890-4)
N.B. Please, do not ever again assume gender in your comments. I am not nor have I ever been the owner of male genitalia. It’s insulting and frankly sexiest to make that presumption. Do better!
S. Water, the word I used was mens rea, Latin for criminal intent.
Alan,
Your omission of the small mountain of authoritative evidence of widespread and systematic electoral fraud in the 2020 US elections - video testimonies from many senior Republican observers, and security footage of boxes of ballot papers pulled from under counting room tables and fed into tally machines while counting had supposedly been suspended, to name but two - perpetuates the myth that the elections were free and fair.
All false. See Disproven: My Unbiased Search for Voter Fraud for the Trump Campaign, the Data that Shows Why He Lost, and How We Can Improve Our Elections by Ken Block
Block was the data scientist hired by the Trump campaign to investigate every fraud claim.
There are two ways to look at the actions of President Trump after the 2020 before certification. You could conclude that he was acting as a candidate to be able to overthrow the “results” of the state counts announced on TV. The second way is to consider his actions those of fulfilling the Take Care Clause, secondary to his oath of office, to “take care that the laws are faithfully executed.” (Specifically his responsibility), regardless of the results of his actions. Because there were significant irregularities in the election, the matter needed to be attended to in a timely fashion. This goes directly to motive. It is the burden of the State to prove a men rea, a criminal intent.
Alan,
For such a senior jurist, your omission of the small mountain of video evidence, including many detailed testimonies from experienced Republican electoral volunteers and security footage of boxes of ballot papers being pulled from under counting room tables and entered into counting machines overnight while counting had supposedly been halted overnight, is beyond belief.
By failing to mention that evidence, your statement "Trump's behavior following his 2020 loss was wrong." helps to perpetuate the myth that the 2020 elections were 'free and fair' when clearly they were anything but.
It gets a little confusing as to whether we are commenting on what someone has written or to Professor Dershowitz’s article. The Professor’s article was excellent and insightful.
The analogy by S Water does not relate to the indictment. Maybe S Water can explain his analogy. I don’t see how it relates.
I think we are off topic too often as well. I signed up to learn, and should have kept quiet.
Very well stated with much insight.
Hypothetically, let’s say a man’s one year old son has been stolen from his crib. The father is distraught. One year later, he sees a child with a woman who looks remarkably like his son. He informs the authorities, but the police inform the father he is mistaken; it’s not his son. The father doesn’t accept the explanation and uses the court to prove his paternity. A DNA test reveals the boy isn’t his and the case is thrown out. But the father doesn’t believe the test is accurate. He decides, with the help of his friends, to enter the home of this child in the dead of night and take him from his bed. He believes the child is his and it is the only way he knows to get his son back. The plan fails when the families security system detects the father’s friends trying to enter the house. Should the father and his friends be be charged for conspiracy to attempt a kidnapping? Or, as you say, the father was simply wrong and being wrong is not a crime. He believes the boy to be his and as long as he believed - no problem. He doesn’t have to face charges for attempted kidnapping. Happy days! I think we all know this result is preposterous.
Ridiculous....
Great, you’ve expressed your view, now support it. Explain how the analogy fails.
In this case there is absolute proof, scientific proof the boy is not his own. The court held the child was not his. He might have appealed, but he committed a two crimes by B+ E, and attempting to kidnap. He needs a good attorney and sympathetic jury.
The facts of the case are not analogous to the subject at hand.
Like the amplify I presented, there is absolute proof that the specific accusations of fraud are false. Ken Block, a data scientist specialising in elections, was hired by the Trump Campaign to investigate every claim of fraud. He determined that all of them were false and explains why in his book,
Disproven: My Unbiased Search for Voter Fraud for the Trump Campaign, the Data that Shows Why He Lost, and How We Can Improve Our Elections
Have you read it? Will you read it? Of course not, because critical thinking demands review of information that doesn’t necessarily align with ideology and has nothing to do with confirming a bias.
I don’t see how this relates to the indictment or to what happened and what is currently happening. It is very clear that the democratic party is doing whatever they can to get rid of their strongest opponent in the upcoming election. If this indictment is so legitimate, why are they just now pulling it out of the bag ? It’s so obvious ! Grasping at straws!
The hypothetical scenario relates to counts 2-4 of the indictment. Regardless of whether DJT believed he won the election on account of fraud, his campaign was unable to prove it in court. It filed over 60 lawsuits and lost every one. No one had the legal right to obstruct the certification of the election, nor to arrange for a slate of fake electors, nor to pressure the vice president to refuse certification in contravention of the 22nd amendment of the constitution as has been alleged. His ‘belief’ is not a defence.
The indictment is legitimate because it was the opinion of 16-23 citizens (not the Democratic Party, the President, nor Attorney General) of a grand jury, after reviewing the evidence, that there is a probable cause the crimes were committed. As with all indictments, President Trump is presumed innocent.
You likely see the indictment as illegitimate and grasping at straws because, as a supporter of Donald Trump, all of your news information is derived from sources friendly to the former president. They tell viewers and readers this is a witch-hunt , that the charges are meritless. You are living in a bubble of information shared by people with the same ideology - your tribe.
The law functions outside of the tribes. Lady justice prevails even in the most disturbing of times. If President Trump
Is innocent of the charges, I believe he will be acquitted.
What a truly ridiculous and not on point analogy!
If you believe the analogy to be erroneous,, challenge it. Explain what elements in the hypothetical case are dissimilar to the former President’s case. Make a cohesive argument and have fun with it. What you’ve written is of no meaning without anything to substantiate your point.